Author Topic: ABC and D and E -- First Aid, CPR and AED  (Read 3683 times)

alfsauve

  • Semper Vigilantes
  • Top Forum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7183
  • DRTV Ranger
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 447
ABC and D and E -- First Aid, CPR and AED
« on: May 06, 2015, 08:36:39 PM »
So my "company" had mandatory CPR/AED training this week.   I wondered how this was going to work.  1 instructor, 100 people and 1 hour.  No way.

BOY HAS CPR and FIRST AID TRAINING CHANGED.

First, for those who've taken it,  ABC was the memory key about what to do.  Airway, Breathing and Circulation.   Simple enough.   I had my own key and it was BBB.  Better Business Burueau.  No, no.   Breathing, Beating, Bleeding, was what I called it.  I like alliteration better than alphabet or number lists.  Anyway so you'll know they've added D, Disability, and E, Exposure/Examine to the list, so it's ABCDE.   (I'll stick with BBB.)

BUT SHE DIDN'T TEACH US THIS.   JUST MENTIONED IT IN PASSING!!

First, understand, I'm from the Boomer Generation.  We were taught 2 spaces at the end of a sentence.  Take salt pills if you're sweating a lot.  And First Aid was at least an 8 hour course.   I took a First Aid Boy Scout course.  I was taught it in high school.  In the military I took another week long course.  Then as a volunteer for the City of Jacksonville, as a first responder, I took another 2 days.   Granted it has been several decades.  So how do 100 people get through CPR in 40 minutes in 2015?

What these short courses are banking on is based on 911 response times.   If you assume that for most of us, most of the time, help, EMS, is just a few minutes away, you don't have to really do a whole lot.  The emphasis on basic first aid is CPR.  Not even that.  Really just concentrate on chest compressions.  It you don't feel like doing, mouth-to-mouth, don't.  The best thing you can do for somebody is keeping the blood moving.     That's the basics.  Sure, if they're not experiencing cardiac arrest and they have a severly bleeding wound, apply direct pressure.  (Nose bleeds, hold the nose down not up!)  If it's an allergic reaction and they have an Epipin, administer it.  Give Benedril for anybody else.  Call 911 always.   That's it.  And as far as the AED?  Stay on the line with 911 and they'll step you through it.  Oh.  And the Heimlich maneuver was covered.  That's all we covered.

If, a big IF, you buy into the paradigm that help is only a few minutes away, that's really all you need to know.  And that's what "they" are teaching these days.


That's all well and good... for that paradigm.  Obviously, many of us find ourselves in situations a little bit more removed than "a couple of minutes".     Most of the country does have Cell Service, but don't bank on it.  I keep a complete, hard copy, first aid book handy in the first aid kits.  I also have a much more comprehensive first aid, survival book that's in the bug out bag.

Remember my definition of "disaster" is when 911 isn't going to respond.  And it's not difficult, even in our populated areas to have that happen at any time.  Riots, chemical spills, fires, terrorists, extensive traffic accidents, weather, earthquakes or volcanoes(yes they can and have happened in the CONUS), are all it takes to put you hours or days away from EMS help.

Will work for ammo
USAF MAC 437th MAW 1968-1972

les snyder

  • Top Forum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1011
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: ABC and D and E -- First Aid, CPR and AED
« Reply #1 on: May 06, 2015, 09:41:34 PM »
as shooters, or as a gift if you have loved ones in law enforcement ... you might consider upgrading what you carry in your range bag or off body carry bag... something like
personal protection gloves and wipes
tourniquet
compression bandage and packing
clotting sponge
chest seal or petroleum gauze
tape
irrigation syringe
since photo, the shears have been replaced with EMT shears, and nasal pharyngeal airway included



tombogan03884

  • Guest
Re: ABC and D and E -- First Aid, CPR and AED
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2015, 06:22:12 AM »
as shooters, or as a gift if you have loved ones in law enforcement ... you might consider upgrading what you carry in your range bag or off body carry bag... something like
personal protection gloves and wipes
tourniquet
compression bandage and packing
clotting sponge
chest seal or petroleum gauze
tape
irrigation syringe

Duct tape ! It really DOES fix ANYTHING !

The "call 911" mentality, and approach to first aid, is insanely irresponsible. It doesn't take a disaster, There are stretches of highway between towns 10 miles apart here in NH (Rt 16, between Conway and Ossipee, and between Ossipee center and Wakefield ) Where because of the lay of the land, there is no cell coverage. There are 3 fire and rescue stations in the 20-30 mile stretch, but unless they are looking for smoke signals you are on your own.
With the current mentality of "call 911" you would be SOL.

alfsauve

  • Semper Vigilantes
  • Top Forum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7183
  • DRTV Ranger
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 447
Re: ABC and D and E -- First Aid, CPR and AED
« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2015, 07:00:33 AM »
Duct tape ! It really DOES fix ANYTHING !

The "call 911" mentality, and approach to first aid, is insanely irresponsible. It doesn't take a disaster, ..[snip]
With the current mentality of "call 911" you would be SOL.

That's my point.  911 is okay for where I work, across the street from a fire station and a police precinct.   The abbreviated, very abbreviated training was probably adequate for our staff, but I'd hardly pass as true First Aid/CPR certified.   I'd call it 911 training.    And let's face it, most of the staff, most people, will not respond when the opportunity presents itself.  It's like Buck Fever.  They'll freeze. 

LES:  thanks for the tip.  I do have some LEO friends and I never thought to give them the things you mentioned.   I'll keep it in mind.
Will work for ammo
USAF MAC 437th MAW 1968-1972

tombogan03884

  • Guest
Re: ABC and D and E -- First Aid, CPR and AED
« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2015, 07:14:49 AM »
Think how much worse it is out West where some states, like Texas, have counties that are the size of NH.

Sponsor

  • Guest
Re: ABC and D and E -- First Aid, CPR and AED
« Reply #5 on: Today at 01:43:42 AM »

billt

  • Top Forum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6760
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 454
Re: ABC and D and E -- First Aid, CPR and AED
« Reply #5 on: May 07, 2015, 07:47:51 AM »
So my "company" had mandatory CPR/AED training this week.   I wondered how this was going to work.  1 instructor, 100 people and 1 hour.  No way.

First, understand, I'm from the Boomer Generation.  We were taught 2 spaces at the end of a sentence.  Take salt pills if you're sweating a lot.  And First Aid was at least an 8 hour course.   I took a First Aid Boy Scout course.  I was taught it in high school.  In the military I took another week long course.  Then as a volunteer for the City of Jacksonville, as a first responder, I took another 2 days.   Granted it has been several decades.  So how do 100 people get through CPR in 40 minutes in 2015?

This type of nonsense is set up by companies in order to comply with their insurance carrier regulations. As basically worthless as a 40 minute CPR course is, the fact they had it, and have proof the employees went through it, (Everyone in attendance must have signed a sheet of paper saying such, and received some little card saying you've been "trained" in CPR), gets them off the hook legally if someone were to drop at work.

This amounts to nothing more than CYA, much like "discussing" sexual harassment policies, and posting them on the company bulletin board. As if everyone doesn't already know grab ass, along with asking for a blow job will get you canned. All are as useful and realistic as tits on a bull. What a lot of people don't realize is CPR done improperly can do more harm than good. It's not something you train people at in 40 minutes or less, anymore than you would to fly an airplane. As always, most all of this kind of crap can be traced back to lawyers and lawsuits. They're the ones causing the real "harassment" in modern society. 

les snyder

  • Top Forum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1011
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: ABC and D and E -- First Aid, CPR and AED
« Reply #6 on: May 07, 2015, 07:53:23 AM »
I'm starting to see tourniquets in belt pouches of the Sheriff's Deputies around here...

the duct tape is to seal 3 edges of the petroleum gauze for a chest wound...to allow one way valve with the plastic used as a flap

tombogan03884

  • Guest
Re: ABC and D and E -- First Aid, CPR and AED
« Reply #7 on: May 07, 2015, 08:12:50 AM »
I'm starting to see tourniquets in belt pouches of the Sheriff's Deputies around here...

the duct tape is to seal 3 edges of the petroleum gauze for a chest wound...to allow one way valve with the plastic used as a flap

No need for that.

http://www.shtfblog.com/new-product-built-in-tourniquet-shirts-and-pants/

New Product: Built-In Tourniquet Shirts and Pants

Got TEOTWAWKI Wear?

This new clothing line developed by Blackhawk Products Group is pretty rad, it comes with ITS! Oh right, “ITS” – Integrated Tourniquet System. Ayuh, it’s designed to save lives in a combat zone. Blood loss from having a limb suddenly disappear in a blast or from severing a femoral artery means “bye, bye life” for many soldiers. If you get a big slash in the mighty femoral artery you’ll have about 2 minutes to stop the bleeding before you pass out. You’ll have about 3 minutes before you croak. In other words – time is of the essence! Check these pants:
Sweet, push the button and – shazam! Cut the blood flow action with ease. Check the features on the shirt:
Four tourniquets built into the shirt (2 per arm)
Always present
Single handed application
Flip pull twist activation
Safe and secure lock down
Activate in seconds
Complete occlusion of blood
Ability to train to build muscle memory
Combined weight is less than one traditional tourniquet
Useful in training scenarios and can be reactivated multiple times.

From their site:

    “The majority of preventable deaths come from loss of blood resulting from leg and arm wounds that is not protected by body armor. Sixty percent of preventable combat deaths are from extremity bleeding and 50-70% of all combat injuries are from extremity wounds.”

“But wait,” you say, “soldiers ALREADY carry tourniquets.” Yes, but it’s pretty hard to put one on if you’re pinned inside a Humvee or if it’s buried inside your pack at the other end of the room. Two minutes before you pass out – need we say more?

Scope their products (and source of pic) here. Want to buy some of this TEOTWAWKI wear? The shirt will run you $69.99 right here. The pants will run you $79.99 right here.

WTSHF the ambulance won’t be there for you when zombies munch into your leg for dinner. Yeah, you’ll whip out the Glock 9mm and blast ‘em in the dome, but still . . . they’ve infected your blood stream – push the tourniquet button! Stop that blood in its tracks.

JC5123

  • Top Forum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2572
  • Fortune sides with him who dares.
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: ABC and D and E -- First Aid, CPR and AED
« Reply #8 on: May 08, 2015, 10:12:40 AM »
No need for that.

http://www.shtfblog.com/new-product-built-in-tourniquet-shirts-and-pants/

New Product: Built-In Tourniquet Shirts and Pants

Got TEOTWAWKI Wear?

This new clothing line developed by Blackhawk Products Group is pretty rad, it comes with ITS! Oh right, “ITS” – Integrated Tourniquet System. Ayuh, it’s designed to save lives in a combat zone. Blood loss from having a limb suddenly disappear in a blast or from severing a femoral artery means “bye, bye life” for many soldiers. If you get a big slash in the mighty femoral artery you’ll have about 2 minutes to stop the bleeding before you pass out. You’ll have about 3 minutes before you croak. In other words – time is of the essence! Check these pants:
Sweet, push the button and – shazam! Cut the blood flow action with ease. Check the features on the shirt:
Four tourniquets built into the shirt (2 per arm)
Always present
Single handed application
Flip pull twist activation
Safe and secure lock down
Activate in seconds
Complete occlusion of blood
Ability to train to build muscle memory
Combined weight is less than one traditional tourniquet
Useful in training scenarios and can be reactivated multiple times.

From their site:

    “The majority of preventable deaths come from loss of blood resulting from leg and arm wounds that is not protected by body armor. Sixty percent of preventable combat deaths are from extremity bleeding and 50-70% of all combat injuries are from extremity wounds.”

“But wait,” you say, “soldiers ALREADY carry tourniquets.” Yes, but it’s pretty hard to put one on if you’re pinned inside a Humvee or if it’s buried inside your pack at the other end of the room. Two minutes before you pass out – need we say more?

Scope their products (and source of pic) here. Want to buy some of this TEOTWAWKI wear? The shirt will run you $69.99 right here. The pants will run you $79.99 right here.

WTSHF the ambulance won’t be there for you when zombies munch into your leg for dinner. Yeah, you’ll whip out the Glock 9mm and blast ‘em in the dome, but still . . . they’ve infected your blood stream – push the tourniquet button! Stop that blood in its tracks.

We discussed these pants in the class that I took a couple weeks ago. The issue is that they cannot build the windless of the tourniquet stout enough and they are not effective enough at stopping arterial bleeding. I don't believe Blackhawk even offers them anymore.  Point being, just buy a CAT-T

I am a member of my nation's chosen soldiery.
God grant that I may not be found wanting,
that I will not fail this sacred trust.

 

SMF spam blocked by CleanTalk