The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Down Range Cafe => Topic started by: fatbaldguy on November 18, 2012, 05:34:51 AM
-
So, they are liquidating a few months into the SECOND bankruptcy in five years. The conservative pundits are all blaming the unions.
I did twenty years at Wonder Bread. Yeah, the last ten was like doing hard time in prison. There is enough blame to go round, management and union alike. Personally, I would place more on Management. Something like 60/40. The unions were plenty greedy for a long, long time. During the first bankruptcy (I quit the company before the wage cuts began), the front line employee's, of which I was one, took a fifteen percent cut, off the top. Plus benefit cuts. Management failed to cut the deadwood and bloat within its own ranks. Nineteen people in management to supervise sixty? Really? Never changed.
Management also failed to adapt to new market conditions vis a vis product and product placement. They got away from the core principles of bread and cake sales.
The Unions, raised dues on the members even as wages fell or were cut. Health insurance (provided by the union) grew more expensive and provided less coverage, even as wages fell or were cut. And still the unions wanted more.
We were paid commission, if it didn't sell, we didn't get paid. Quality collapsed, and prices increased. Sales tanked.
Before blaming any one group in particular, every party should be scrutinized closely.
I'm just glad I got out when I did. I like to think I saw it coming and bailed before the crash. I got a five year head start on the folks too afraid to make the move.
-
SAVE THE TWINKIES!!!!!
-
Surely there is plenty of blame to go around but Hostess brands are pretty much lousy products as far as I've seen. I don't and have not bought their products in decades. I think I have only eaten maybe one package of Twinkies in my entire life! At some point, management and the employees need to realize they're making a product that fewer and fewer people are willing to buy.
-
Hostess cake products have sucked ass for the last ten years, but nobody makes a better loaf of fresh bread! Knowing what I know of the baking and bread industry having worked in it for 15yrs., the politics and bs of it have become outrageous!
I too, believe that management are more to blame than unions.
-
I didn't buy them anymore because they tasted like crap. Looked good...tasted bad...like cardboard. I don't know why the ingredients became that-a-way, but they did. Looks like some marketing whiz worked themselves into a cheaper product spiral...with some help from other's I would imagine.
On that note, there's a candy store in Tulsa that sells jelly beans, gummie bears, etc. and they cost about 3x more than what you would pay at Wallymarty....but they taste just like they did when I was a kid. This is a confirmation to me that the ingredients have been dumbed down over the years for a lot of things...steaks taste the same, the cornbread I make tastes the same, the jelly/jam I make tastes the same....it's all that store bought stuff that sucks now. They call all go the heck out of business for all I care if they participated in "extending" their ingredients and dumbing them down. I'd rather pay $3 for jelly beans once a month than $1 a week for jelly beans that taste like crap.....
-
It surprised me to find out how many brands that are affected by this! What I'm not surprised is that I don't buy any of them! Like Rastus, I'd much prefer to make my own than eat from this list!
Baker's Inn
Beefsteak
Blue Ribbon
Bread du Jour
Butternut Breads
Colombo
Cotton's
Di Carlo
Dolly Madison
Drake's
Dutch Hearth
Eddy's
Good Hearth
Holsom
Home Pride
Hostess
J.J. Nissen
Merita
Millbrook
Mrs. Cubbison's Foods
Nature's Pride
Parisian
Standish Farms
Sweetheart Bakery
Twinkie
Toscana
Wonder Bread
-
No brainer that management did not keep up with the changing market tastes. Some of that was forced by attempts at keeping financially sound and that failed. But to try to absolve the baker's union from putting the last nail in the coffin? Absurd. Perhaps they did us a favor by getting rid of a lousy company. Maybe some of the brands will be picked up by companies that reside in right to work states; maybe not. Nothing lasts forever. Haven't had a twinkie since high school...sigh.
-
No brainer that management did not keep up with the changing market tastes. Some of that was forced by attempts at keeping financially sound and that failed. But to try to absolve the baker's union from putting the last nail in the coffin? Absurd.
Never tried to absolve any participants blame here. Just trying to get some to understand that labor is not the ONLY one to be blamed. The last nail? Probably. Management had a hammer in their hand too.
-
Bad thing about many products is that in looking to make them cheaper, they work to get them to taste the same...talking about produce here...not candy...
Tomatoes, ...all the work they do to try to keep them tasting as much like the older ones...and still not real good job...but the great loss is in nutrition... It takes 10 tomatoes to give the nutrition of one tomato of, say 40 years ago..same with apples...
Beef is the same...with the hormones and grain feeding, they managed to keep a good taste..but nutrition wise it is miserable...instead of being good for your health like grass fed beef, current beef causes health problems...
But it tastes great.
-
Bad thing about many products is that in looking to make them cheaper, they work to get them to taste the same...talking about produce here...not candy...
Tomatoes, ...all the work they do to try to keep them tasting as much like the older ones...and still not real good job...but the great loss is in nutrition... It takes 10 tomatoes to give the nutrition of one tomato of, say 40 years ago..same with apples...
Beef is the same...with the hormones and grain feeding, they managed to keep a good taste..but nutrition wise it is miserable...instead of being good for your health like grass fed beef, current beef causes health problems...
But it tastes great.
That's why heart patients are told that beef is bad, but then told venison and buffalo are OK.
Modern store bought meats and vegetables are basically a manufactured product .
-
That's why heart patients are told that beef is bad, but then told venison and buffalo are OK.
Modern store bought meats and vegetables are basically a manufactured product .
Exactly.
-
The industrialization of agriculture are planks #8 and #9 in the 10 planks of Marxism:
http://laissez-fairerepublic.com/tenplanks.html
-
About the only store bought meals at my place is frozen veggies. I make just about every thing from scratch.
-
Not talking about packaged meals...but the beef, pork, chicken, eggs and vegetables themselves.
It's all grown using industrial farming procedures which has slashed nutritional value while trying to salvage some bit of taste and palatability.
Even if you grow your own veggies but use commercial seed, you haven't gained much...better control of what is dumped on them while growing. If you go that route try to locate "heirloom" seeds...and keep the seeds from the very best of the crop for next time...unlike commercial seeds, those seeds will germinate.
-
Have you signed the petitiom to Nationalize twinkie production?
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/nationalize-twinkie-industry/cJz0ngJR
-
Cream filling is lard and powdered sugar! Bad enough to clog the most hardy artery!!! LOL
Richard
-
The industrialization of agriculture are planks #8 and #9 in the 10 planks of Marxism:
http://laissez-fairerepublic.com/tenplanks.html
And that explains the Death Tax, both Federal and State. It is a whole lot easier to nationalize farmland that is under the control of a huge Agribuisiness Conglomerate than it is from a bunch of "bitter clingers" who have farmed the land for generations.
Family farms are becoming a thing of the past, just like the American ship building industry and others, because of the .gov's unsatiatable appetite for more money to redistribute. Those that adapt will survive for now, those farms that don't will pass on with the current generation.
-
Cream filling is lard and powdered sugar! ..........
Yeah....HAHA. And a whole bunch of Iraqi's ate them..HAHAHAHAHHA.
....
Tomatoes, ...all the work they do to try to keep them tasting as much like the older ones...and still not real good job...but the great loss is in nutrition... It takes 10 tomatoes to give the nutrition of one tomato of, say 40 years ago..same with apples.......
Beef is not so great. I save up and buy 1/2 a beef from farmer when it's slaughter time...saves money and is grass/grain fed no growth hormones. I like the longhorn/angus blend. Also, on tomatoes, they are so hydridized for shipping they taste like crap. Sometimes you can get an old-timey strain which is good....I have some legacy seeds.
Never tried to absolve any participants blame here. Just trying to get some to understand that labor is not the ONLY one to be blamed. The last nail? Probably. Management had a hammer in their hand too.
Yeah, weak and greedy management combined with over-the-top expectations of becoming an assembly line millionaire. Both of them are unrealistic and self-serving. No one wants to hurt anyone's feelings by being direct with the truth until the name calling starts and someone get's mad.....sounds like the RINO Republicans being mommy boy managers ..... and leftists communists being labor leaders.
And that explains the Death Tax, both Federal and State. It is a whole lot easier to nationalize farmland that is under the control of a huge Agribuisiness Conglomerate than it is from a bunch of "bitter clingers" who have farmed the land for generations.
Family farms are becoming a thing of the past, just like the American ship building industry and others, because of the .gov's unsatiatable appetite for more money to redistribute. Those that adapt will survive for now, those farms that don't will pass on with the current generation.
What else can you say? All the families need to establish a Trust (welfare for attorney's) to avoid this insanity if possible. The best thing that can happen is for the US is to experience a total economic collapse.
-
Talking of Farms.
Agenda 21's purpose is to collectivize farming moving the population into urban centers where they cannot be self sufficient and have no choice but to depend on the Gov.
-
Have you signed the petitiom to Nationalize twinkie production?
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/nationalize-twinkie-industry/cJz0ngJR
I was trying to explain this one to the wife the other day.. Couldn't make it stick..
Do you realize how absurd that one is??
BO says "Ask me to bail it out! Go ahead, ask me!! I need a mandate to serve the people! Ask me!! Beg me to save a job!!"
How bizarre that is.. I guess I should look at that petition site. Or not.. I wonder if you can start one to remove him from orifice, or maybe prosecute vote fraud, or maybe just leave us the hell alone.. ::)
-
I was thinking.....there might be a money making proposition in the demise of the Official Twinkie.
I know I must have eaten one somewhere along the line, but I don't remember it...
But, if someone can devise a kit so they can be made at home, there may be a nice market for the kits about now.
Not only will folks still have their beloved Twinkie, they can make them from stuff they might actually be happy to be putting in their mouths.
-
I guess it's time for me to stock up on cupcakes and zingers before it's too late.
-
Economists are predicting that some company will buy the Twinkie name and recipe, and that they will continue to be made.
In other words, Twinkies will most likely survive bankruptcy AND thermonuclear war.
-
That's why heart patients are told that beef is bad, but then told venison and buffalo are OK.
They may want to get a second opinion.
-
Twinkie recipe:
http://www.topsecretrecipes.com/Hostess-Twinkie-Recipe.html
Cream filling recipe:
http://www.topsecretrecipes.com/Hostess-Twinkie-Creme-Filling-Recipe.html
-
I was thinking.....there might be a money making proposition in the demise of the Official Twinkie.
I know I must have eaten one somewhere along the line, but I don't remember it...
But, if someone can devise a kit so they can be made at home, there may be a nice market for the kits about now.
Not only will folks still have their beloved Twinkie, they can make them from stuff they might actually be happy to be putting in their mouths.
Twinkie recipe
Step one, go to Springfield
Step two, avoiding the hounds,visit Monty Burns' house and get a barrel of nuclear waste......(Smithers might cut you a better deal) or check Homer's back pockets.
Step three...... ;D
-
In the 50's they ran a batch of Twinkies with banana cream filling, and in the 70's they ran a second batch switching to vanilla cream. We have been surviving on the 70's batch ever since, and they have another millennium of them stored away ;D
-
My understanding it was during ww2 they could not get bannas so they switched. no real loss. I hate bannas always have.
-
My understanding it was during ww2 they could not get bannas so they switched. no real loss. I hate bannas always have.
It's a joke! The dates are approximate, but the fact that the polystyrene cake base doesn't mold is pure fact ;)
-
No dairy ingredients = no mold. The shelf life is about 3 or 4 weeks IIRC.
-
Let's have some respect for the dead. Someone needs to bury the twinkie and say a few words over it. I vote for Tyler. Tyler would have the right bible passages in a nanosecond. He's impressive with his research that even Google can't rival. And, then, let's all forget about it. What this country needs is a good 5c cigar; ask BC about that.
-
My understanding it was during ww2 they could not get bannas so they switched. no real loss. I hate bannas always have.
Why could they not get bananas ?
Bananas come from Central America .
-
Most likly a cost thing or the war department took them. Just the story I have heard
-
If twinkies were still banana flavored I would eat them. And TAB is right according to snopes. http://www.snopes.com/food/ingredient/twinkies.asp
-
Twinkie recipe
Step one, go to Springfield
Step two, avoiding the hounds,visit Monty Burns' house and get a barrel of nuclear waste......(Smithers might cut you a better deal) or check Homer's back pockets.
Step three...... ;D
You gotta think outside the box, FQ....
Think almond flour, a bit of corn meal and a Stevia sweetened whipped yogurt center, maybe?
-
I don't understand all of the uproar and consternation. Open a cookbook, turn on the oven, and bake some stuff! My wife makes stuff far better than anything made by this conglomerate, and she does it for a fraction of the price. Fruit pies, whoopie pies, skunks, and cookies ;D All we need to do is put them in the lunch box on the way out the door in the morning, and I have my driving treat or meeting break snack to get my sugar high.
I feel for the 18,500 or so that will be out of work, but Pres. BHO claims we are doing so well that they will have no problem finding a better job anyway.
-
Well, since there seems to be major union involvement in this event, many employees either directly or indirectly supported BHO's re-election.
-
Well, since there seems to be major union involvement in this event, many employees either directly or indirectly supported BHO's re-election.
Most of them don't get it and don't care.
We were discussing this today here. This may, hopefully, be a first step in forcing unions out of the workplace. Unions were a useful entity in the 20s-30s but aren't any longer. Look at all the money taxpayers have spent on bailouts and subsidies because a unionized company can't afford to do business anymore between Federal/state and union regulations. Most union employees think the union is doing them a favor, when in fact they are taking thier money for lawyer fees and for the leadership perks that the worker never sees. Hostess finally said"fine, we close and sell the brand off to a non-unioin company that can make it better."
Someone mentioned that the current union rules for Hostess is that only one product type can be transported in a van marked for that product. More unioin employees to drive the stuff around but exponential costs in maintenance and supply chain management. Now a non-union company can take over and streamline the process and save 30% or more. Yes, there would be layoffs, but they're being laid-off anyway if the company closes.
-
Unions are both good and bad. Unions that train people ( like the old school construction trades) to do tasks are a good thing. the other unions, I don't see much use for these days.
-
TAB/Tom, My mother explained to me that during WWII, bananas were rationed due to shipping restrictions related to the war effort. This apparently occurred at the time our doctor put me on a banana diet to combat a potassium deficiency. So, my mother traded cigarette ration coupons (she didn't smoke anyway) in order to get some bananas for me. Interestingly, my current doctor tells me that I have a potassium deficiency (still?) and what do you think he prescribes for this? A banana a day! There are other food sources, of course, but bananas are the easy thing to consume at breakfast. Banana creme centers for twinkies would be health food for me!
-
I knew they were high in Potassium.
Shortage of shipping makes sense too.